c'est bien mort ici dis donc

13000 messages

Pas tant que ça.
C'est même plutôt actif à mon avis.

J'aurais plutôt parlé d'une question d'habitude. ^^

Je n'ai jamais nié ce que tu sous-entendais, mais la phrase en elle même étant absurde car elle serait elle-même relative et donc impliquerait que tout n'est pas relatif, ce qui revient à la contredire, et de ce fait je préfère ne pas l'utiliser quand c'est possible. ^^

Sortir de la subjectivité de la conscience est simple : fait des mathématiques.
Dans un contexte donné chaque objet possède une seule et unique définition.

Attention, je parle bien des objets mathématiques, pas des symboles qui les représentent.

Ce n'est pas une quelconque relativité des mathématiques qui imposent le contexte, mais les mathématiques elles-même.
Un objet mathématique dépourvu de contexte perd son caractère mathématique (et devient par ailleurs bien souvent philosophique).

L'absence de contexte empêche de parler de mathématiques.

Ensuite le manque de connaissances en mathématiques est un autre problème, non lié aux mathématiques mais à leur utilisation.

Justement on ne sent pas que 1 et 1 font 2, on définit que dans le contexte dans lequel on est 2 c'est 1 et 1. De là c'est assuré puisque strictement arbitraire.

Et le 1 parfait, c'est 1, pas plus que ça, il est déjà parfait en lui même puisque complètement défini par essence.
C'est ça aussi la beauté des mathématiques tout est parfait en soi.

Aussi l'infini n'a rien de vague c'est la fermeture maximale de l'ensemble des nombres réels, bref le nombre maximal que l'on peut atteindre via une suite strictement croissante da nombres réels (et qui ne peut lui même être un nombre réel pour des raisons évidentes d'encadrement réel).

"Sortir de la subjectivité de la conscience est simple : fait des mathématiques."

Il me semble qu'une explication s'impose.

Les déterminations géométriques et mathématiques dont font usage les science de la nature suppose l'opération subjective qui les produit et sans laquelle elles ne seraient pas : il n'y a dans la nature ni nombre ni calcul, ni addition ni soustraction, ni droite ni courbe : ce sont là des significations idéales qui trouvent leur origine dans la conscience qui les crée.

Nous ne parlons pas de la même chose. Ce que je dis est simple : les déterminations mathématiques et géométriques n'existent pas en dehors d'une conscience et d'une subjectivité.

Que la somme de 1 et 1 est égal à 2 ou à 3 m'importe peu ici.

Elle est où Sophie ?

Il y a peu, Sofea, tu m'as taxé d'antisémite et de conspirationniste. J'aimerais que tu me laisses simplement poster ce message. Je ne ferai pas de commentaire. Je posterai simplement une liste du nombre de Juifs dans l'administration américaine, pour les éventuels intéressés.

Partial list of Jews in the Bush Adminstration:
(March 26, 2003)

Richard Perle
One of Bush's foreign policy advisors, he is the chairman of the Pentagon's Defense Policy Board. A very likely Israeli government agent, Perle was expelled from Senator Henry Jackson's office in the 1970's after the National Security Agency (NSA) caught him passing Highly-Classified (National Security) documents to the Israeli Embassy. He later worked for the Israeli weapons firm, Soltam. Perle came from one the above mentioned pro-Israel thinktanks, the AEI. Perle is one of the leading pro-Israeli fanatics leading this Iraq war mongering within the administration and now in the media.

Paul Wolfowitz
Deputy Defense Secretary, and member of Perle's Defense Policy Board, in the Pentagon. Wolfowitz is a close associate of Perle, and reportedly has close ties to the Israeli military. His sister lives in Israel. Wolfowitz came from the above mentioned Jewish thinktank, JINSA. Wolfowitz is the number two leader within the administration behind this Iraq war mongering.

Douglas Feith
Under Secretary of Defense and Policy Advisor at the Pentagon. He is a close associate of Perle and served as his Special Counsel. Like Perle and the others, Feith is a pro-Israel extremist, who has advocated anti-Arab policies in the past. He is closely associated with the extremist group, the Zionist Organization of America, which even attacks Jews that don't agree with its extremist views. Feith frequently speaks at ZOA conferences. Feith runs a small law firm, Feith and Zell, which only has one International office, in Israel. The majority of their legal work is representing Israeli interests. His firm's own website stated, prior to his appointment, that Feith "represents Israeli Armaments Manufacturer." Feith basically represents the Israeli War Machine. Feith also came from the Jewish thinktank JINSA. Feith, like Perle and Wolfowitz, are campaigning hard for this Israeli proxy war against Iraq.

Edward Luttwak
Member of the National Security Study Group of the Department of Defence at the Pentagon. Luttwak is reportedly an Israeli citizen and has taught in Israel. He frequently writes for Israeli and pro-Israeli newspapers and journals. Luttwak is an Israeli extremist whose main theme in many of his articles is the necessity of the U.S. waging war against Iraq.

Henry Kissinger
One of many Pentagon Advisors, Kissinger sits on the Pentagon's Defense Policy Board under Perle. For detailed information about Kissinger's evil past, read Seymour Hersch's book (Price of Power: Kissinger in the Nixon White House). Kissinger likely had a part in the Watergate crimes, Southeast Asia mass murders (Vietnam, Cambodia, Laos), Installing Chilean mass murdering dictator Pinochet, Operation Condor's mass killings in South America, and more recently served as Serbia's Ex-Dictator Slobodan Milosevic's Advisor. He consistently advocates going to war against Iraq. Kissinger is the Ariel Sharon of the U.S. Unfortunately, President Bush nominated Kissinger as chairman of the September 11 investigating commission. It's like picking a bank robber to investigate a fraud scandal.

Dov Zakheim
Under Secretary of Defense, Comptroller, and Chief Financial Officer (CFO) for the Department of Defense. He is an ordained rabbi and reportedly holds Israeli citizenship. Zakheim attended attended Jew’s College in London and became an ordained Orthodox Jewish Rabbi in 1973. He was adjunct professor at New York's Jewish Yeshiva University. Zakheim is close to the Israeli lobby.

Kenneth Adelman
One of many Pentagon Advisors, Adelman also sits on the Pentagon's Defense Policy Board under Perle, and is another extremist pro-Israel advisor, who supports going to war against Iraq. Adelman frequently is a guest on Fox News, and often expresses extremist and often ridiculus anti-Arab and anti-Muslim views. Through his hatred or stupidity, he actually called Arabs "anti-Semitic" on Fox News (11/28/2001), when he could have looked it up in the dictionary to find out that Arabs by definition are Semites.

I. Lewis Libby
Vice President Dick Cheney's Chief of Staff. The chief pro-Israel Jewish advisor to Cheney, it helps explains why Cheney is so gun-ho to invade Iraq. Libby is longtime associate of Wolfowitz. Libby was also a lawyer for convicted felon and Israeli spy Marc Rich, whom Clinton pardoned, in his last days as president.

Robert Satloff
U.S. National Security Council Advisor, Satloff was the executive director of the Israeli lobby's "think tank," Washington Institute for Near East Policy. Many of the Israeli lobby's "experts" come from this front group, like Martin Indyk.

Elliott Abrams
National Security Council Advisor. He previously worked at Washington-based "Think Tank" Ethics and Public Policy Center. During the Reagan Adminstration, Abrams was the Assistant Secretary of State, handling, for the most part, Latin American affairs. He played an important role in the Iran-Contra Scandal, which involved illegally selling U.S. weapons to Iran to fight Iraq, and illegally funding the contra rebels fighting to overthrow Nicaragua's Sandinista government. He also actively deceived three congressional committees about his involvement and thereby faced felony charges based on his testimony. Abrams pled guilty in 1991 to two misdemeanors and was sentenced to a year's probation and 100 hours of community service. A year later, former President Bush (Senior) granted Abrams a full pardon. He was one of the more hawkish pro-Israel Jews in the Reagan Administration's State Department.

Marc Grossman
Under Secretary of State for Political Affairs. He was Director General of the Foreign Service and Director of Human Resources at the Department of State. Grossman is one of many of the pro-Israel Jewish officials from the Clinton Administration that Bush has promoted to higher posts.

Richard Haass
Director of Policy Planning at the State Department and Ambassador at large. He is also Director of National Security Programs and Senior Fellow at the Council on Foreign Relations (CFR). He was one of the more hawkish pro-Israel Jews in the first Bush (Sr) Administration who sat on the National Security Council, and who consistently advocates going to war against Iraq. Haass is also a member of the Defense Department's National Security Study Group, at the Pentagon.

Robert Zoellick
U.S. Trade Representative, a cabinet-level position. He is also one of the more hawkish pro-Israel Jews in the Bush (Jr) Administration who advocated invading Iraq and occupying a portion of the country in order to set up setting up a Vichy-style puppet government. He consistently advocates going to war against Iraq.

Ari Fleischer
Official White House Spokesman for the Bush (Jr) Administration. Prominent in the Jewish community, some reports state that he holds Israeli citizenship. Fleischer is closely connected to the extremist Jewish group called the Chabad Lubavitch Hasidics, who follow the Qabala, and hold very extremist and insulting views of non-Jews. Fleischer was the co-president of Chabad's Capitol Jewish Forum. He received the Young Leadership Award from the American Friends of Lubavitch in October, 2001.

James Schlesinger
One of many Pentagon Advisors, Schlesinger also sits on the Pentagon's Defense Policy Board under Perle and is another extremist pro-Israel advisor, who supports going to war against Iraq. Schlesinger is also a commissioner of the Defense Department's National Security Study Group, at the Pentagon.

David Frum
White House speechwriter behind the "Axis of Evil" label. He lumps together all the lies and accusations against Iraq for Bush to justify the war.

Joshua Bolten
White House Deputy Chief of Staff, Bolten was previously a banker, former legislative aide, and prominent in the Jewish community.

John Bolton
Under-Secretary of State for Arms Control and International Security. Bolton is also a Senior Advisor to President Bush. Prior to this position, Bolton was Senior Vice President of the above mentioned pro-Israel thinktank, AEI. He recently (October 2002) accused Syria of having a nuclear program, so that they can attack Syria after Iraq. He must have forgotten that Israel has 400 nuclear warheads, some of which are thermonuclear weapons (according to a recent U.S. Air Force report).

David Wurmser
Special Assistant to John Bolton (above), the under-secretary for arms control and international security. Wurmser also worked at the AEI with Perle and Bolton. His wife, Meyrav Wurmser, along with Colonel Yigal Carmon, formerly of Israeli military intelligence, co-founded the Middle East Media Research Institute (Memri),a Washington-based Israeli outfit which distributes articles translated from Arabic newspapers portraying Arabs in a bad light.

Eliot Cohen
Member of the Pentagon's Defense Policy Board under Perle and is another extremist pro-Israel advisor. Like Adelman, he often expresses extremist and often ridiculus anti-Arab and anti-Muslim views. More recently, he wrote an opinion article in the Wall Street Journal openly admitting his rascist hatred of Islam claiming that Islam should be the enemy, not terrorism.

Mel Sembler
President of the Export-Import Bank of the United States. A Prominent Jewish Republican and Former National Finance Chairman of the Republican National Committee. The Export-Import Bank facilitates trade relationships between U.S. businesses and foreign countries, specifically those with financial problems.

Michael Chertoff
Assistant Attorney General for the Criminal Division, at the Justice Department.

Steve Goldsmith
Senior Advisor to the President, and Bush's Jewish domestic policy advisor. He also serves as liaison in the White House Office of Faith-Based and Community Initiatives (White House OFBCI) within the Executive Office of the President. He was the former mayor of Indianapolis. He is also friends with Israeli Jerusalem Mayor Ehud Olmert and often visits Israel to coach mayors on privatization initiatives.

Adam Goldman
White House's Special Liaison to the Jewish Community.

Joseph Gildenhorn
Bush Campaign's Special Liaison to the Jewish Community. He was the DC finance chairman for the Bush campaign, as well as campaign coordinator, and former ambassador to Switzerland.

Christopher Gersten
Principal Deputy Assistant Secretary, Administration for Children and Families at HHS. Gersten was the former Executive Director of the Republican Jewish Coalition, Husband of Labor Secretary, Linda Chavez, and reportedly very pro-Israel. Their children are being raised Jewish.

Mark Weinberger
Assistant Secretary of Housing and Urban Development for Public Affairs.

Samuel Bodman
Deputy Secretary of Commerce. He was the Chairman and CEO of Cabot Corporation in Boston, Massachusetts.

Bonnie Cohen
Under Secretary of State for Management.

Ruth Davis
Director of Foreign Service Institute, who reports to the Office of Under Secretary for Management. This Office is responsible for training all Department of State staff (including ambassadors).

Daniel Kurtzer
Ambassador to Israel.

Cliff Sobel
Ambassador to the Netherlands.

Stuart Bernstein
Ambassador to Denmark.

Nancy Brinker
Ambassador to Hungary

Frank Lavin
Ambassador to Singapore.

Ron Weiser
Ambassador to Slovakia.

Mel Sembler
Ambassador to Italy.

Martin Silverstein
Ambassador to Uruguay.

Lincoln Bloomfield
Assistant Secretary of State for Political Military Affairs.

Jay Lefkowitz
Deputy Assistant to the President and Director of the Domestic Policy Council.

Ken Melman
White House Political Director.

Brad Blakeman
White House Director of Scheduling.

PS: Cette liste n'est pas de moi. Notez qu'il est écrit "liste PARTIELLE(!)" du nombre de Juifs dans l'administration Bush.

Tiens, Absconditus, avant que Sofea ne revienne (ça fait un moment qu'on l'a plus vu), et que tu passes par-ci, est-ce que tu peux me dire pourquoi on dirait que tu fais une telle affaire personnelle de ce qu'une simple forumeuse a dit de toi ? Je crois avoir déjà balancé un post de ce genre la dernière fois, mais si tu m'as répondu, Sofea ne m'a alors pas laissé le temps de voir ta réponse

Je n'aime pas insulté, et surtout j'aimerais que l'on puisse parler librement de ce genre de sujet. Mais comme je vous l'avais dit, c'est si subversif que ça n'est pas possible.

être insulté*

Une insulte doit engager un auteur, or (c'est mon point de vue, tu n'es pas forcé de le partager) sur internet on a rien d'autre que des pseudos sur son écran, pas des gens, comme ceux que l'on pourrait rencontrer hors de chez soi. Même dans la vraie vie, c'est difficile de se faire une idée de la personnalité de quelqu'un, alors dans le domaine virtuel... Fais-en ce que tu veux, mais à ta place j'essayerais de rester au-dessus de ça et de me cantonner aux idées. Je n'avance rien à propos de Sofea parce que je me moque pas mal de l'affaire, pour te le dire clairement, mais s'il s'avérait que c'était un mec no-life sans ami sans but dans la vie sinon d'apaiser ses frustrations à la manière d'un troll, quoi... j'vois pas ce que son jugement pourrait affecter chez moi. J'vois pas quelle valeur il aurait.

(tu devrais éviter de dire "vous", j'ai pas vu ton message, comme beaucoup d'autres peut-être)

Je n'ai pas vu non plus mais il semblerait que la "plainte" soit plus adressée à une supposée liberté d'expression entravée qu'envers l'expression d'un quelconque jugement personnel (considéré comme insultante) à l'égard de l'auteur de cette-dite plainte (je me réfère juste au dernier message et à l'emploie du terme "surtout"... Après, que ça soit honnête ou non, ce n'est plus vraiment de notre ressort ^^ )
_________________________

- Je t'abhorre
- olol mé moua osi jte kif mon bestaaa xd <3

Absconditus --> Dans un poste très laconique, tu avais formulé l'épistémologie kantienne de cette façon : phénoménal/nouménal. Or, il me semble que Kant, dans sa critique, sort de ce couple disjonctif apparence/essence pour adopter le couple conjonctif apparition/condition de l'apparition.

La différence est considérable, le renversement lui même est proprement incroyable.

Mais heu ! je suis encore début de la fic, faut pas me bousculer comme ça. Quand j'arriverai à ce stade, je penserai à toi et tes ups désespérés.

C'est Kaileena, quoi.

"regrettable message sur lequel je ne m'étendrai pas"

Oh non, tu l'as lu ? Celui qui m'a valu de perdre mon pseudo ?